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I agree about ISO. I have earlier tried to involve myself in a standardisation committee and help the process by providing them with input free of charge. They charge for that! Per year! So I do not spend time trying to do anything with ISO as it seems to
be about money. I recently heard that some universities reward standardisation work in the way we reward publications in Norway. I think that might be the reason why a lot of people contribute to ISO.</div>
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The group seems to just be starting, being led by a senior advisor from the Netherlands. The Netherlands came up with archiving by design, so it makes sense they would do this as well.</div>
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My experience with Noark is that it is great. I've worked on it for so many years. It has a number of shortcomings stemming from the XSD files. I think classification is sorely underdescribed and should be moved outside the structure and linked back. I also
think that it should be possible to have a record and file at the same level, so you can import file system data and annotate it. I am working on syllabus data at the moment and believe we can manage and make the data available from nikita. That along with
the pictures from TAM-arkiv, your work on RT messages really shows that a lot is possible based on standardised approaches.</div>
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I have to figure out what I want greqAPI to be first before I can decide how it should be implemented. It definitely carries from the Noark API, but does not need to be constrained to Noark. I have spoken to an archival institution, and they are interested
in seeing how it could be used as an approach for standardised "innsyn" across fagsystem.</div>
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With regard to giving input to the ISO process. I would be happy to do that, but ISO want national committees to comment and develop their standards. I am not interested in asking people if they can bend the rules for me, and I guess ISO would not be happy
if their standards were developed without people paying the ISO tax.</div>
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- Thomas</div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>Fra:</b> nikita-noark <nikita-noark-bounces@nuug.no> på vegne av Petter Reinholdtsen <pere@hungry.com><br>
<b>Sendt:</b> tirsdag 28. juni 2022 10:35<br>
<b>Til:</b> nikita-noark@nuug.no <nikita-noark@nuug.no><br>
<b>Emne:</b> Re: Recordkeeping by design</font>
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<div class="PlainText">[Thomas Sødring]<br>
> I was recently informed about the following work on implementing<br>
> ‘records management by design’.<br>
><br>
> <a href="https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommittee.iso.org%2Fsites%2Ftc46sc11%2Fhome%2Fnews%2Fcontent-left-area%2Fnews-about-standarization-in-t-1%2Fnew-ad-hoc-group-formed-to-look.html&data=05%7C01%7Ctsodring%40oslomet.no%7Cf443e0134dc749e75f6008da58e12201%7Cfec81f12628645508911f446fcdafa1f%7C0%7C0%7C637920021222238759%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=0j29XWh3iqGEH%2Fx7GMfq4AJ2SPJx49Y5YdNVo7RAd1A%3D&reserved=0">
https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommittee.iso.org%2Fsites%2Ftc46sc11%2Fhome%2Fnews%2Fcontent-left-area%2Fnews-about-standarization-in-t-1%2Fnew-ad-hoc-group-formed-to-look.html&data=05%7C01%7Ctsodring%40oslomet.no%7Cf443e0134dc749e75f6008da58e12201%7Cfec81f12628645508911f446fcdafa1f%7C0%7C0%7C637920021222238759%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=0j29XWh3iqGEH%2Fx7GMfq4AJ2SPJx49Y5YdNVo7RAd1A%3D&reserved=0</a><br>
><br>
> From what I can tell, it is still early stages.<br>
<br>
Any idea who the members of this 'Ad Hoc Group 8' is? Sad to see it is<br>
organized as part of ISO, where the specifications normally are only<br>
available at a very high cost, and the standardization process is not<br>
very transparent. I experienced the latter first hand while trying to<br>
work with Standard Norge and ISO in the OOXML standardization fiasco.<br>
<br>
> While our work does not directly talk about a by-design approach, I do<br>
> think that is basically what we are arguing for in that paper. We saw<br>
> that some users of data processing systems saw Noark as archaic and<br>
> not flexible. Given our work with nikita I really do not understand<br>
> that opinion. It really shows the amount of ignorance that is floating<br>
> around out there.<br>
<br>
>From my experience the Noark specification is very flexible, and I have<br>
been able to shooehorn in everything I have tried to get structured<br>
according to the Noark 5 XML format so far.<br>
<br>
> Slowly I am working on greqAPI, and I think Noark/nikita and greqAPI<br>
> will be very good examples of records management by design. The<br>
> problem with records management by design is that there are so many<br>
> varying cultural and legal descriptions of what records management is.<br>
<br>
As I understand it greqAPI is a english edition of the Noark 5 API with<br>
less structural restrictions. What about making greqAPI a compile time<br>
option of Nikita, instead of creating a code base from scratch?<br>
<br>
> I look forward to seeing what the ISO group develop.<br>
<br>
Perhaps a good idea to get in touch with it and try to give input<br>
directly instead of waiting to see what come out of it?<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Happy hacking<br>
Petter Reinholdtsen<br>
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